The "Naked-Truth" IS THIS--"Neither Obama nor McCain have seen a "Depression" !!   I have--and it's worst than you think!  Obama is a Lawyer from the Court-room, and McCain is the "Maverick" from Congress--  Neither will be an "Economic Genius"! Neither have that "Qualification"--so the American People are "Stuck with that Realization"!!  It will take at least 3 to 5 years for things to get half-normal.  The "Bail-Out" is a failure! Throwing Money at large Corporations--means that you have only 'guaranteed' all of the Employees, including the Corporation's Officers--"Their Salaries for the next year"! This gives them--some time to see if they can make their Corporation "Profitable again"! Good Luck on your "Night-mares"-!  A 12% rated Congress has to come up with some better solutions than that--  That's NOT the President's JOB!!

Interesting logic.  You have to literally have lived through the Great Depression to be able to make positive changes to the economy as president?

... Btw someone switched your punctation keys around on your keyboard.  It's a cruel joke.  It makes all your statements look like this!!!!! 

Much of what you say is not the responsibility of the federal government, rather state and local governments.  Education is a local issue funded primarily by the decisions of local school boards.  Teaching religion is not a role for the schools, unless your child is enrolled in a parochial school, it's the role of the parents and the church they attend to teach religion.  The federal government's role is to establish a fair playing field through reasonable regulation and oversight.  They (the executive branch) have the ability to guide investment through regulation with congressional oversight.  However, those federal dollars should be spent on research which should then be transferred to american industries for the private sector so they can develop a viable product (and jobs) without the artificial economic influence of subsidies and tax incentives.  I agree that the President has little control over the economy without the support of Congress.  If Obama is elected policy decisions, his along with Congress, better be good ones or there will be no one else to blame.

A lot of it will have to run it's course. It took a long time to get here, so it'll take a while to get out of it. I think with good sound economic policies it doesn't have to get worse than predicted. I think bad policies (like continuing the Bush economic plan) can definitely exacerbate the circumstance we're in.

Kennedy said - "Ask NOT what your country can do for you.  Ask what you can do for your country."  Barack says - don't worry, the government will provide for you.  They're hardly comparable.  We have a population voting for handouts from the government which is the reason for the decline of American society. 

Makessense2me,
I've yet to hear him say anything even resembles that the government will take care of everything...What do you mean when you say this?  Can you point to any statement made by Obamathat can back up this claim, or are you just throwing stuff out there hoping it sticks...a la McCain-Insane-Campaign?
He asks the young college student to sacrifice time to volunteer in the military, local social programs etc. in exchange for college tuition.
He asks American families to sacrifice by reducing their energy consumption.
He asks the very rich amongstus to give back the tax cuts given to them by this administration so that we can give a break to those in the middle class.  Trickle down economics is not working because of the greed and corruption of these execs...
He plans on re-building our infrastructure, investing in our roads, bridges, rail lines, ports, schools and energy plants, which will put people to work, improve our standard of living and modernize our infrastructure.  We need to do this, as China is doing the same thing.  (For example, right now China's ports can manage 4x the volume that our largest port can manage.  It's time we modernize our ports AND made them safe.)
He is challenging today's greatest American scientific minds to come up with energy that will fuel our lives tomorrow.  He will take some of those tax incentives that are currently going to oil companies, who just this week reported 3rd quarter profits 148% higher than last year and invest them in companies that are working on creating alternative energy along with vehicles that will run on electricity and alternative fuels.
So where's the hand-out you're talking about?  None of this is possible if we all just stay complacent.  It's pretty clear to me that we all have a stake in turning our great country around.  Maybe you're the one looking for a handout...I know I'm not...I'm looking forward to putting our country back on track!
GET OUT THE VOTE!!!!!!!

He asks that we pay additional taxes.  "Bitter men are not pleased with the suppression of taxes. Not daring to condemn the measure, they attack the motive; and too disingenuous to ascribe it to the honest one of freeing our citizens from unnecessary burthens and unnecessary systems of office, they ascribe it to a desire of popularity." --Thomas Jefferson to Benjamin Rush, 1801. ME 10:304   "Our citizens may be deceived for awhile and have been deceived; but... we may trust to... the tax-gatherers [for light]; for it is not worth the while of our anti-republicans to risk themselves on any change of government but a very expensive one. Reduce every department to economy, and there will be no temptation to them to betray their constituents." --Thomas Jefferson to Archibald Stuart, 1799. FE 7:378

Rolling back the tax breaks to match what they were in 2000?  Do you suppose we just keep borrowing money from China to be able to fund both wars? 

BTW... showed examples of how he was like Kennedy in asking us to sacrifice...where's your example of how he isn't like Kennedy...?

We pay taxes every time we purchase gas to maintain that infrastructure (21 cents per gallon).  If it were being used properly, we wouldn't have to "re-build".  Expanding railroads is a subsidy to the railroad industry.  How is that different then tax breaks for the oil company?  Airports are funded by local bond issues and user fees that are included in your plane fair.  95% of the workforce doesn't pay income taxes.  Yes, they pay payroll taxes (ie SSI and Medicare/caid) however, those are supposed to be put in the "trust fund" for their retirement.  If we're reimbursing our contributions of today (which are really paying for our parents/grandparents today), should we still be entitled to future benefits?  The fact is, there is no trust fund it has been wasted by the excesses of government and now Obama wants to expand the waste.  "I am for a government rigorously frugal and simple, applying all the possible savings of the public revenue to the discharge of the national debt; and not for a multiplication of officers and salaries merely to make partisans, and for increasing by every device the public debt on the principle of its being a public blessing." --Thomas Jefferson to Elbridge Gerry, 1799. ME 10:77

Fred,

you wanted an example of how Obama is not like Kenedy.  I can not remember Kenedy hanging out with domestic terrorists and accepting contributions from foreign terrorsits.

.

Obama will have to prove he is like Kenedy.  It is very anoying everyone wants to say this guy is Mr. Incredible.  He has done almost nothing in his career because he was waiting for his big moment.  He know will have his big moment.  I hope he takes advantage of it and does 1/10th of the things he has said he will do.  So far in Illinois all he has done is vote to kill babies (even ones that have been born alive).

.

I am still praying he did not lie when he said he has our best interest in mind.  But that is hard to believe from a person who said we were as bad Nazi Germany.

I hope you guys are right for all of our sake.

Your examples (investing in infrastructure) appear to be more attribuable to President Roosevelt's administration rather than Kennedy's.  Kennedy started the space race which produced new technology that was then transferred to the private sector to develop into beneficial (perhaps) products.  The techology for new energy already exists, it just hasn't been proven to be economically viable without subsidies such as those you profess are being provided to the oil industry.  I need to research the oil industry's net income after taxes to determine whether the government (federal and state) earn more from the oil industry than the shareholders do.

MakesSense2me,

i agree with a lot of what you say, but you must obviously have too much income.  Everyone i know that has a job pays income taxes.  There are several lines other than FICA on your pay stub.  You should take a look at it.  There is Federal tax withholding and State tax.  A lot of people get a refund if they have had too much withheld.  That refund will now be smaller under Obama for everyone. 

When he says we will pay no  more taxes he is refering to a time before the tax cuts of Bush.  The extra money we received on our refund because of his tax break will no longer be.

The federal government was never designed to be large - "The extent of our country was so great, and its former division into distinct States so established, that we thought it better to confederate as to foreign affairs only. Every State retained its self-government in domestic matters, as better qualified to direct them to the good and satisfaction of their citizens, than a general government so distant from its remoter citizens and so little familiar with the local peculiarities of the different parts." --Thomas Jefferson to A. Coray, 1823. ME 15:483  "Our country is too large to have all its affairs directed by a single government. Public servants at such a distance, and from under the eye of their constituents, must, from the circumstance of distance, be unable to administer and overlook all the details necessary for the good government of the citizens; and the same circumstance, by rendering detection impossible to their constituents, will invite public agents to corruption, plunder and waste." --Thomas Jefferson to Gideon Granger, 1800. ME 10:167

gguelde,

I think you left out some talking points...check your notes and try again...LOL

MS2Me,

When I look at McCain and Obama, I don't see which one is talking about shrinking the size of government.  I hear a lot of pork barrel elimination from McCain, but that's just a fraction of a percent of all of our spending.  So when I look at their plans I ask myself which one is talking to my needs.  Which one is going to benefit our environment?  Which one will leave the office better when he leaves it than when he took it over?  I know you like Jefferson, but the reality is that we now expect more from our government than he had envisioned.  That's the reality of where we are.  Neither of these guys is Jefferson; and I don't see a "Jefferson" in the horizon.  "The beast (the people) has been fed, and now we must eat more!"  -Fred A
I know I'm going off topic here, but it totally irks me when I hear McCain talk about how our service men navigate safely in nuclear subs.  Has he once told us how that nuclear waste is discarded?  Does anyone know what happens to it?  Well...it gets tubed and dumped on the bottom of the ocean...Yeah...that sounds safe...This is an example of the short-sightedness that I don't want to see in my next leader.  Building more nuclear (Not Nucular...but that's a whole other subject!) plants is not the best solution.  Drill baby drill is not the best solution.  But when I hear Palin talk, all I hear is oil.  Today she gave an energy speech at a plant that manufactures solar panels...do you know that she spent 5 minutes on their innovative product and the rest of the time talking about drilling in Alaska, off shore etc.  What happened to invent baby invent?

You're a good guy to converse with.

"[With the decline of society] begins, indeed, the bellum omnium in omnia [war of all against all], which some philosophers observing to be so general in this world, have mistaken it for the natural, instead of the abusive state of man. And the fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follows that, and in its train wretchedness and oppression." --Thomas Jefferson to Samuel Kercheval, 1816. ME 15:40

MakesSense: I guess you do make sense. What a very appropriate quote to describe the Bush administration! Of course, taxation follows debt and can be oppressive; but how else do we get out of debt? What happens when there are no more programs to cut? Hoover, a republican, then Roosevelt, a democrat, to bail us out. Reagan, a republican, then Clinton, a democrat, to get rid of Reagan's debt (which at the time was the largest America ever had - more than all the preceding presidents combined.) Now Bush, a republican, burdened us with even more tremendous debt, and now we need Obama, a democrat, to bail us out. 

The debt "W" has left us with may just do what Jefferson said - leave us weak and in decline. How can America be seen as a force in the world when we can't afford to take care of our own needs? If you want to talk history, why didn't Bush II learn from Reagan that "trickle down"/supply side economics doesn't work? That deregulation and lack of oversight as in the Reagan years caused record foreclosures (til now), caused the demise of the savings and loan banks, and the wealthy just became wealthier (to its extreme today!) We can go back to the 1700 and 1800s in England when power and wealth were in the hands of a few.  What happened to them and their country? What about France and its revolution?

Last night Obama said that the government can't solve all of the people's problems and shouldn't, but it can help in many ways.  He talked about individual responsibility, and he is right. Work with your kids when it comes to schoolwork, watching too much TV, and sitting on the computer too long. Save some of your money (that's if you have a job and a job that pays a living wage.) Give back - volunteer, help others, get community spirit. And so on... We need to get back to being civil, tellling the truth, being polite and couteous to one another, taking care of ourselves and others, working hard, and stop the "me, me, me" way of thinking.  A tragedy shouldn't be the only way Americans come together.

You can quote Jefferson (or Karl Marx) all you want.  But the quotes must apply to what you are trying to say. Any one can open a book and take out a line or two; doesn't make that person an intellect or thoughtful thinker.

Chuck,

It's Halloween...but you're going to have to do better than this to scare me out of voting for Obama...Booo!

I think there are plenty of Barack supporters on both sides of the isle to show me that he won't necessarily govern from the far left.  I truly believe he has our country's best interests in mind, and that's why you can't find one lobbyist on his campaign team.  McCain's campaign is being run by the very lobbyists that funded the RNC.  This is why he wasn't able to run as the centrist that he was in 2000; this is why he has Palin on his ticket, and this is why, should he be elected, you will not see one ounce of change. 

Vote Obama 08!!!

Obama is a lawyer, he is not a businessman.  Policiticians did not make this country great, it was the ability of the individual to take control and responsibility for their own prosperity.  It was through the genius of our founding fathers who developed a constitution that was intended to prevent government from becoming an obstacle to economic development.  "I like the power given the Legislature to levy taxes, and for that reason solely approve of the greater house being chosen by the people directly. For though I think a house chosen by them will be very illy qualified to legislate for the Union, for foreign nations, etc., yet this evil does not weigh against the good of preserving inviolate the fundamental principle that the people are not to be taxed but by representatives chosen immediately by themselves." --Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1787. ME 6:387

MakesSense,

Good quote.  Right now our government, left and right, are corporatist...they're only FOR the people when they NEED the people.  And to get those votes they rely on millions of dollars that come from corporations that then help mold the regulations...or de-regulations and policies.  I like what Obama has done because he has solidified your quote in giving WE THE PEOPLE back control over our President.  WE funded his campaign, not some corporation.  So I agree that it's time for us to take control of our own prosperity...it's also time for our taxes to stop going to corporate welfare hoping that those at the very top will use that money to give the "poor folk" jobs.

The quote is against taxation - "We are endeavoring... to reduce the government to the practice of a rigorous economy, to avoid burthening the people and arming the magistrate with a patronage of money, which might be used to corrupt and undermine the principles of government." --Thomas Jefferson to Mr. Pictet, 1803. ME 10:356

So, what I meant above is that McCain, being that his campaign is funded and run by lobbyist, if he were to get elected he will reward those lobbyist by awarding them projects paid for with our tax dollars, or with more corporate tax breaks.  Since Obama's campaign was funded by the people, he doesn't fall victim to those pressures.

And rolling back the tax cuts to pre 2000 is fine when you're in the middle of two wars that are currently being partially funded by the Chinese.

And Mr. Obama didn't receive any money from FNMA or FHLMC?  If the government would get out of manipulating the economy, either through taxation, subsidies, etc. then the lobbyists wouldn't have anything to lobby for or against.   Taxes based on consumption leave lobbyists powerless and politicians less likely to be manipulated.  The truth is that we don't know who is funding Obama's campaign and why is he spending so much to secure a $400,000/year job?  "It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world." --Thomas Jefferson to A. L. C. Destutt de Tracy, 1820. FE 10:175

We do know some of his campaign contributors.  OPEC has given nearly a million dollars to Obama while giving less than 100K to McCain.  So much for lowering gas prices.

he has also received several contributions that were "errantly charged" to individuals credit cards at the sum of 2,300 each.  When asked for refunds these people were given the run around and then hung up on by campaign staffers.  No refunds were issued until the media started to run the story.

he has also received large ammounts of money from terrorsists on the GAZA strip.

If everyone actually thinks that the american people, in one of the worst economic downturns this centry, have donated enough to allow him to spend 150 million a month on his infomercials; they should be riding the short bus.

Given all of the negatives this man has i still hope he does ok.

Hmmm...Pay as you go...Now where have I heard that before...and are you also in favor of eliminating the corporate tax breaks

Fannie & Freddy...Hmm...You've got me there.  I'm not familiar with when he received their contributions, and all I've ever been able to find is that $120 of the $126k that he received were from individuals.

Why is he spending so much?  Because he can.  I would ask the same of McCain.  He's got plenty of money at home...why does he need a job that makes $400k?  At least we can agree that Obama walked away from a cushy job after graduating to go work as a community organizer.  So maybe his intentions are good.  My point is that his life actions have shown that he values more than just money, and service, not money seems to be his motivation in life.  That's someone I can look up to.

gguelde,

I was waiting for someone like you to add their -2 cents.  Stop listening to Micheal Weiner; that stuff will melt your brain.  If you can point me to the legitimate stories where it is documented that he is receiving money from terrorist in the middle east and $100k from OPEC, I will gladly read them with an open mind.  And if they are true I will be the first to write in Hillary Clinton as my vote.  PLEASE POST YOUR EVIDENCE OR STOP MAKING RIDICULOUS ACCUSATIONS.

Fred, I'm in favor of a tax on consumption.  A (flat) national sales tax if you will.  That way, the only tax that is collected is collected based on the market.  The tax must be flat so that no lobbyists are trying to influence the purchase of their product over any other.   Those who consume the most will pay the most tax including businesses (ie. no exemption for products consumed for re-sale).  Government will only get paid if the economy is good and their motivation will always be for a strong economy.  This type of tax will not motivate consumption, will not penalize savings or investment, nor will it penalize wage earners.

Fred,

The firs time I heard the terrorist comment was from Sean Hannity.  He referenced a CNN investigative report where they actually went to the Gaza strip to interview the two brothers that were spoken of.  They said in the interview they were still waiting for the check.  This was just after Obama beat Hillary.  Because CNN is die hard democratic there was never followups from the original.  If they were to do a followup and show these two brothers have finally gotten their refund i may change my opinion.  The truth of the statement can not be denied since Mr. Obama said he was returning the donations.  The only debateable portion would be if he did or did not return the money.  This will be difficult to verify because of the location and the media covering the story does not want to take it further.

If you were wondering about the money being charged to individuals credit cards you should check the Kansas City News items.  Both a husband and wife were charged when they should not have been.  Smaller ammounts have been reported in Illinois and Kentucky. 

And by the way i voted for Hillary in the primary and still believe she was the second best Democrat.  With Edwards being my original choice.  Even from 4 years ago Edwards was my choice, but he made some poor decisions.

The only thing obama needs to do right this second is prove hemeets the critira for pres. and show he loves this country i truly believe he is a USA hater, our supreme court knows for a fact that he has misrepensented him self and documentation if he had the nations intrest at heart he would have been totally transparent to the public.

i say they unseal files he has sealed and show our country he is who he says he is.

Have you been asleep for the last 8 years?